Question

[Kigger]

I have a question about breeders. We got Bubba at the end of Feb. A month and a half later Bubba was diagnosed with HOD. HOD is not that common in boxers. Bubba died from complications last Wednesday night. I was just wondering if the breeder should be responsible at all. He is a respected breeder in our area, and a friend of ours. He feels so bad about what happened. Does he owe us money back, or should we get another dog from him. We want another boxer soon. I miss bubba so much. I hate coming home to an empty house every day. So the main thing is.. does the breeder owe us anything. He doesn't have another litter planned for a while and we want another dog before that. Should he help us pay for another boxer. I have never had to deal with anything like this. I don't want to lose him as a friend over somthing like this, and I don't want to press anything unless he should be responsible. I would greatly appreciate any advice anyone can give me. Thanks again in advance.

Kristin

 

[VTbxrFan]

Not my area of expertise, but I would think that what you are owed really depends on what kind of contract you had with the breeder. Were there any health guarantees in the contract? If not, that's a lesson for next time.

I'm sorry about the loss of your puppy -- that's a terrible thing to have gone through.

 

[munchichi2550987]

I am so very sorry for your loss. We are all here for you anytime to listen..

This is not my area of expertise either, but this happened to a dog in my friend's pup's litter. The dog got HOD. They took the pup to the vet and for the past month everything seems to be ok. The girl notified the breeder and he gave her all her money back. They did not have a health contract or sign anything at all. I feel that you should get a refund and I don't think it would be wrong of you to ask. I believe that any good breeder would refund the money as they should guarantee the health of the pups. I know this is not always the case though. I hope everything works out for you..

 

[JulieM]

I too am sorry for your loss.

Legally, if you didn't sign a contract the breeder has no obligation to replace your puppy or refund any of your money. Georgia does not have a puppy lemon law, so there is no recourse there.

Morally, it's a toss-up. From Dr. Billinghurst's "Grow Your Pups With Bones:"

The causes of HOD include a combination of the follwoing: genetics, nutrition, infection, trauma (over-use, over-exercise of soft bones), hormone imbalance, reaction to vaccination, autoimmune disease, and the Distemper virus invading the growth plates and infecting them following vaccination.

So, on the one hand the predisposition to the condition is probably genetic. On the other hand, there are many environmental factors that may have allowed the expression of the condition, which may not have happened in a different environment.

In this particular situation, I would expect the breeder (morally) to refund a portion of the purchaes price. My guess is that this is a 'traditional' breeder, who gives 3-4 or more rounds of puppy vaccs, feeds kibble, etc., and as such he is responsible for the pre-sale environmental factors that helped lead to the condition.

(Interestingly, Dr. B does mention Boxers as one of the breeds where HOD is commonly found. While I wouldn't go so far as to call it rare, it does seem to be uncommon in the breed in the US, so perhaps it's more common in the breed in Australia....)

 

[PawPrintBoxers]

As a breeder, I have never even heard of HOD. What does it stand for?

 

[PawPrintBoxers]

Originally posted by Kigger
I was just wondering if the breeder should be responsible at all. He is a respected breeder in our area, and a friend of ours. He feels so bad about what happened. Does he owe us money back, or should we get another dog from him. We want another boxer soon. I miss bubba so much. I hate coming home to an empty house every day. So the main thing is.. does the breeder owe us anything. He doesn't have another litter planned for a while and we want another dog before that. Should he help us pay for another boxer. I have never had to deal with anything like this. I don't want to lose him as a friend over somthing like this, and I don't want to press anything unless he should be responsible.

Again, speaking as a breeder. You are going back and forth with your references to the breeder. You state he is a personal friend and the relationship is dear to you. But then you turn 3rd party and call him "the breeder" and ask if he owes you something.

I would have to say you need to sit down and talk to him as your friend. Then decide on a personal level which relationship is most important and worthy of pursuing: Friendship or business. Now, the two can go hand in hand, but that will be up to you and him.

A quality breeder will do all they can to ensure the health of a puppy. But there are limitations to what we honestly can control. So just take a some time to sit down and speak with your friend. In the case you have given, there are no right or wrong answers anyone can offer; only polite suggestions.

 

[luvfritz]

Hi, my heart aches for you, what a terrible experience. I'm just a boxer owner so I don't know what you can do legally. I saw on Court TV that someone had sold a horse to a couple who planned to ride the horse, and he would be a pet. They no sooner got him home than they discovered he had a leg problem that they hadn't noticed before. This made him unable to be ridden. They tried to prove the seller knew about the defect but it was almost impossible because the seller denied knowing and said the horse could have been injured travelling to the couples' home in a horse trailer. The judge awarded money only for medical costs, but they were stuck with the horse, who now would just spend his days in his stall. Your seller is a friend so I don't think he would honestly sell you a sick puppy. I am saddened that he hasn't contacted you in some way.
I agree with the other posts, this probably will cost you a friendship if the seller hasn't offered compensation by now. You could try your luck in Small Claims Court. I personally would not buy another puppy from him, assuming the next litter will come from one of his boxers that may have fathered/mothered Bubba (if it was genetic).

 

[JulieM]

Originally posted by PawPrintBoxers
As a breeder, I have never even heard of HOD. What does it stand for?

HOD stands for Hypertrophic Osteodystrophy. Here's some information on it (scroll down about 1/3 of the way):
http://www.labbies.com/dysplasa.htm

 

[PawPrintBoxers]

So following this website, vitamin supplements are are no-no. Deficiency in Vitamin C is an issue so that would be the only supplement allowed?

"Growing Pains" are very common in Boxers around 3-6 months, as the chart stated. But usually the pain goes away within a few days. It usually shows up during a growth spurt. Even human boys can have similar pain in their leg joints due to rapid growth.

I had no idea such a condition could manifest into such a horrible thing. You have my most sincere sympathies. I will definitely watch what I give growing puppies in the way of extras.

 

[JulieM]

Originally posted by PawPrintBoxers
So following this website, vitamin supplements are are no-no. Deficiency in Vitamin C is an issue so that would be the only supplement allowed?

I think calcium supplements, actually, as it talks about the calcium/phosphorus ratio. Also, more recent studies have ruled out Vitamin C deficiency as a contributing factor. Distemper vaccination, however, has been indicated at a trigger (distemper virus has been found in the affected growth plates).