What do you consider a demodex "spot"?

[MissLady]

Hi BW,
I'm trying to figure out exactly what is considered a demodex spot. As in...if the pup has 4 or more spots, it's generalized v. local.

So, is a spot anywhere where the hair falls out?

Or, is a spot anywhere that develops one of those round, reddish, slightly raised demodex patches that sometimes look like a ringworm?

I'll ask the vet next week when the office is open. But, in the meantime, does anyone know?

 

[Cami]

A spot would be where the hair had fallen out or was thinning.
Localized is less than the majority of the body having missing hair and no secondary skin infections.
Generalized is a greater portion of the body missing hair with secondary infections of the skin.
I don't recall d-mange presenting with any red, raised patches that resemble ringworm. At least it didn't present that way with my girl or a few rescues I have seen with it.
Possibly sarcoptic mange but not d-mange unless the area were particularly bothersome and the dog was licking the area or again a skin infection had developed.

 

[MissLady]

Humn, thanks Cami.

When I brought Lexie to the vet in June it was because she had something that looked like it could be ringworm. When the vet did a scraping, he diagnosed her with demodex. The first spot was on her neck covered by dark hair so you couldn't see it extremely well. This second spot is quarter-sized on the underside of her front leg where there is little hair so it's very visible. I'm thinking it looks like the first one probably looked had there been no hair.

This second spot is what made me ask my question about what to count as a demodex spot.

- If I go with red, little bumpy and and kinda ringworm looking, she now has 2 spots.
- If I go with hair loss but no change in skin, she has them all over her body - but most are tiny and less than pea sized (kinda like she had a rough play session with another pup).

What I'm really trying to figure out is if this local demodex case is turning to generalized and how do I know for sure. Everything I've read says that local heals itself with an improved immune system and further action is not necessary. I guess if she becomes covered with these icky spots and hair continues to fall out, I need to seek more serious treatment.

OK, I guess there is not another question here. I'm just putting it out there just in case anyone has input or other ideas. Thanks!

 

[kateyspon]

my dog was diagnosed with demodex at about 4 months of age.. he started out with 1 small spot on his arm, then within two weeks he had patches all over his body ranging from 1/4-1 1/2 inches. Several of them had the raised red bumps you were describing. Your vet will probably prescribe an antibiotic along with the demodex treatment because the bumps are the beginning of a bacterial infection from the demodex mites clogging up his pores.

the patches will get worse before they get better, but you'll have your dog back to normal in about 8-12 weeks!

 

[MissLady]

Thanks kateyspon. I'm going to keep an eye on the spots. Now she has many teeny tiny spots all over where the hair has fallen out and one of the really ugly spots. I've been using lemon juice and water (BW advice) on the areas that stand out. It seems to be shrinking the big bumpy spot so I think that's good. I don't know that it's doing anything for the hair plugs but I'm pretty sure it's not hurting.

We are still not quite ready for antibiotics but will go there if we have to. Can you believe a week ago I thought the demodex was all-clear. Thank goodness I canceled her spay appointment next week!

 

[MillieLou]

Demodex on pups

My dog also had demodex as a puppy..... we started treated her locally with ivermectin and oil mixed together and just rubbing it on top of the spots.. that started to help but they came back and we ended up having to dip her to fully get rid of the spots. I was really nervous about dipping her since she was a puppy but it got rid of them right away after 2 dips. I would highly recommend it.

Good luck!
-Millies owner

 

[MissLady]

Thanks MilliLou. I really appreciate the info and I find it helpful to know that pups get through the dips successfully. But, this is where I get confused. For those of you who chose to use ivermectin or antibiotics or to dip your pups...exactly how many spots or how bad did it get before you chose one of these options?

Lexie has had 2 spots that look bumpy and ringworm like. The 1st spot was on her neck, popped up around June 26th, and is gone completely. The 2nd spot is on her arm, popped up around July 17th, and has shrunk to half the original size already with lemon juice and water spritzed on it.

I currently see no other bumpy spots - and I check regularly. I do see tiny bumps all over her body but these only result in either a point size bald spot where the bump was or the bump going away with no hair loss at all.

If you look at Lexie, her coat is full and shiny and you would not guess that she has demodex. I only know b/c I inspect daily and noticed something small that turned out to be demodex. Yes, she has thin spots and a bald spot but mostly she has a full coat. I will continue to watch and manage the demodex. I don't think even topical ivermectin is required at this point - a dip is out of the question. Am I fooling myself? Is it foolish to continue on the path we are on without going to strong drugs?

I would find it very helpful to know when those of you who have been through this with your pups moved forward with drugs.
- Did they have bumpy spots all over or on a large part of their coats?
- Did you look at them and cringe b/c they looked so bad?
- Did spots multiply daily and continuously?
- Did a secondary infection occur?

When did "do nothing, wait and see" turn into let's move forward with strong drugs? Does what I described for Lexie sound like we should go there yet?

(Kateyspon - I think you answered this for your case in your post. Thanks! I'm pretty sure Lexie has not hit anything like you described yet. I'm hoping we will have it under control before then.)

Thanks Everybody!

 

[sueco]

Our girl was diagnosed with demodex a week before getting spayed (about 3 weeks ago). She had two good size spots; one on her cheek and one on her shoulder, a couple of smaller spots by her collar, and one on her back. Some of these were hard to see.

Our vet put her on Goodwinol ointment and a supplement called Gluta-DMG. Since she is responding well so far, we will not plan to dip her. We'll keep treating her and monitor the spots.

To answer your questions, based on our experince:

- Did they have bumpy spots all over or on a large part of their coats?
We did notice one spot with a little red bump. This went away after a few days on the ointment.

- Did you look at them and cringe b/c they looked so bad?
We were just hoping they didn't itch her too much!!

- Did spots multiply daily and continuously?
Since starting the ointment, the spots are getting better. We were very lucky that they did not worsen after spaying. This was something our vet said would probably happen.

- Did a secondary infection occur?
So far, we have not seen a secondary infection. (fingers crossed)

 

[MissLady]

Sueco - Thanks. It's good info about spaying your girl. We have delayed Lexie's spay surgery b/c I have been worried about demodex getting out of control. It's good to hear that you went ahead with it and nothing catastrophic happened. I'm going to look into the Gluta DMG - haven't heard of that one before! Currently, we are using Missing Link. But, this could be a completely different kind of supplement.