We Think We've Done All We Can Do

[jaxynpuppy]

It's not that I don't want to believe that folks think I can work this out - it's just that I'm not sure if i'm strong enough to deal with this much longer.

We've already put so much into him, when will we start to see the fruits of our labor? Seriously - will it take until he's 5 years old, or should he settle at around 3 years? The breeder says hers are "couch potatoes" and they are!! I have no idea what happened to mine. His siblings are good too. If he's going to be like this for the next 10 years, then I'm being honest by saying that I simply can't do it. If there's some light at the end of the tunnel, perhaps we can do it for a little while more.

He would NEVER end up in rescue. I could never do that to any dog. As I said, he's a "nice dog" without a mean bone in his body, just very very bad. No one needs to worry about that. He would be returned to the breeder - we would even keep him until she could rehome him as to not upset him twice.

I can completely understnad where you are coming from. And I feel bad for you. I know my family is not extremely knowledgable about training dogs. But we know a few good people who have helped us along to train ours and he is still WILD as you explained. He has to be watched every minute of every day.He is only 7 months old. I have been told it just takes patience. But honestly I am a mother of 3 girls under 6 (whom all adore my dog) I dont always have the time to keep my eye on him every minute. When he is outside he barks incessantly or eats my trees and shrubs. I try to walk him often as I can but we have had to train him to run on a treadmill because it is tough for me to drag the kids out in the winter with a crazy dog. LOL That works well but does not tire him completely. I did learn he has to mouth something when he runs to keep him focused. I think my dog is ADHD !! But that isnt my biggest problem!! His issue mainly is that he gets mad easily and will potty in my house!! It is just one thing I cant handle. When I go tto pick my daughter up at the bus I like to take him with me for the walk. He actually is really good on the leash except when I am trying to fuss with the baby in her stroller and he knows I am not focusing solely on him and he has jumped and almost made me drop the baby. So now as I am preparing to go out I leave him in the house till I get her in the stroller. When I do this he thinks I am leaving him he will poop in front of the door. If I leave to pop into the neighbors for 5 minutes he will pee on the floor. and he has even peed in my heat vents! When my husband finally comes home and wants to spend time with the kids he will push them out of the way and knock them down to get in front and get attention from him. Which then leads me to wonder am I doing him a disgrace having to watch him every minute cause now he thinks he is the centre of attention.
He is extremely smart and very quick learner and he knows his manners and he can use them just seldom does. And I am sure like you there are just so many other things i cant mention cause the list would go on forever. I am trying to be patient but this week is trying with one kid with a cold and the other is teething and tummy aches so there is alot of crying in my house at the moment and the dog potting in the house when ever I turn my back. But hang in there I know it is hard. Ask the breeder/friend what their suggestion for you to do is rather then approach them with just wanting to return the dog. They may respond more graciously when asked for their opinion and even offer to have you return the dog. For me I try to remember I cant return my kids no matter how batty they make me so why should I get to return my dog. So I am hanging in there for now still looking for answers. I do like some of Ceasars training strategies. Thay have worked for me like leash training. I dont like using force either. But as mentioned he is more a behaviouralist. I think you are doing everything you can and good for you for loving your dog enough to recognize the problems and doing what is necessary!!

 

[Box Boys]

It sounds like you've put in a lot of time and energy. Based on what you've written, it's clear that your "fed up" also. That's understandable. It's possible that attitude or feeling you have may be preventing you from moving forward in a positive way with your little guy. For instance, when you are "expecting" the worse, that is likely what you will see. In a sense, it's kind of like raising children. When you focus on the negative more than the positive, that is the behaviour you are likely to see most of. If you're really to the point of no return (and it does sound like that), I would really talk to the breeder. Again, like others have posted, talk to her about what you can try or do next. Surely, she must know how much work you've put into this. If she doesn't, sit down and have a heart to heart with her and explain it. I think that if you approach her with a "help me" state of mind and attitude and express how much you love your pet but don't know what else you can do...she will surely understand. Any reputable breeder wants the best for their pups. I really do believe that she will work with you to help the situation or will work at rehoming him. I don't believe that this should ruin the friendship/relationship that you have. Good luck to you!! Be sure to let us know what happens.

 

[bucca]

take a deep breath and picture yourself somewhere without your dog i do this at least twice a day spanky puts the energizer rabbit to shame he doesnt sit still or nap and whining, he takes the cake but know what? i wouldnt trade it for anything the love and laughter i get from him is worth every moment. you sound like you have put major time into your baby and i can completely understand being frustrated. i did have to laugh because when you said your dog was sneaky that is my spanky, he waits till i turn my back and grabs something and then proceeds to play keep away with it, all the time his nub going a mile a min, he just wants to play. i really do believe you would be doing the right thing in finding a breed for you that is more compatible with your family, more subdued, dont be afraid to talk to the breeder im sure he/she would be happy to find a home for him and i dont believe your friendship would be hurt by this, you probably arent the first ones who have asked them for their help in this kind of situation. i hope it all works out for you and your dog. good luck

 

[MyBoyChamp]

I'm sorry for all the trouble you've had with your boy. My boy Champ is now 17 months old and I see a HUGE difference in him now and just a few short months ago. He does go to doggy daycare most every week day so he gets exercise playing with other dogs. I always say that going to DDC makes him "almost" like a normal dog at night. Some nights he's tired, some he's not. But one thing that works wonders for him to tire him out and give him mental stimulation - and is something he can do ALONE, is get a good chewing workout. Sometimes I give him a big rawhide to chew. Sometimes I give him a meaty bone. He will generally chew on it for a long time and afterwards, he's tired out. I don't know what it is about chewing on a bone but it takes his concentration and works him mentally and physically. I just know that when I'm tired, it's a God send! I try to use different kinds so that he keeps an interest. Even if he hasn't finished with a rawhide yet, I'll buy another kind or the meaty bone, so he can start fresh and he'll be interested. Right now his toy basket has a couple of rawhides and one bone and he'll drag them out himself. But as soon as I need to, I'll bring home something new and different for him.

Another thing I do to settle him down is I'll sit on the floor instead of the couch and we'll play for a few minutes but then I start giving him a really good, full body rub. It will almost hypnotize him and pretty soon, he'll lay down against my leg or half in my lap and I'll continue until he's completely relaxed. Usually at that point, he'll lay there for awhile just chilling out.

I haven't had to do this for a long time but I used to sometimes give him a crate break when he just didn't want to settle down. I'd give him a treat and put him in his crate and I'd stay in the same room with him for 10-15 minutes. Then I'd let him out and a lot of times, just the forced quiet was enough to break him out of his energy level.

Lastly, I would repeat to myself over and over... he's a teenager... he's a teenager... he's a teenager... he'll start settling when he's three... he'll start settling when he's three... Thank goodness he seems to be starting a little early.

One more thing - about the crate - we just started letting Champ stay out of the crate at night and while we're gone. He's done really well at night after a few accidents. During the day I'm still very nervous, but he's been really good. I do want to point out though, that I had to crate my lab until he was 3 1/2 years old before he was trusted in the house. He was a VERY good dog after that (RIP Big Ben).

My advice would be to see if you thought you could stick it out until he is three, since you're almost there and most people say that's the turning point to good behavior. But if you don't think you can do it, it is certainly understandable and I'd just tell your friend that you'd like to rehome him for the good of the dog, like someone else suggested. I'm sure they would understand and want what is best for the dog as well.

Best of luck.

Patty

 

[MyBoyChamp]

I just thought of something else to add. I was thinking of how Champ loves to play with his toys and usually wants us to play with him. But sometimes we're tired! I found a game he loves and it gives him a good mental workout. The mental workout seems to be key here. I took an old comforter and have it nearby. What I do is I take whatever toy he has in his mouth and I hide it in the comforter, making sure to make lots of folds. I put it on the floor (he has to sit while I'm doing this) and then tell him to "find it". He will work that blanket over and over until he gets the toy out. He loves this game and will sometimes try to hide the toy in it himself just to try to get it out again. But of course it's best when someone does it for him. Sometimes he gets it out in a minute and sometimes it takes a lot longer. We do this a few times in a row and it helps to mentally tire him out.

I'm just trying to think of mentally stimulating games your boy can do by himself that will hopefully give you all a break. If he can learn to play by himself, it will go a long ways towards freeing you all up.

I don't have one of these but some people have talked about a cube of some kind that you can put a high value treat inside (a hotdog piece or something like that) that the dog has to work to get out. That would be another good game he can play by himself.

You might have already tried these things but I thought I'd post them just in case you haven't.

If anyone else can think of games or things their boxers do by themselves, please post the ideas.

Patty

 

[SILLY6PAK]

If the breeder is a friend and neighbor then surely they have some idea of what you are going through?

They also know the work and dedication you have put into him.

I do not think you should be worried about being honest with the breeder. A good breeder would much rather see the dog in a home that is a more suitable match.

All this frustration is neither good for you or the dog.

Some dogs (no matter the breed) are just difficult.

If Mia had been my first dog I NEVER EVER would have gotten another dog and I would have thought boxers were the most obnoxious, stuborn, spirited breed.

Even with all my boxer experience Mia was the challenge that makes Marley look tame.

At the age of three Mia is FANTASTIC> SO SO funny and smart. Personality plus. Everyone adores her and loves to hear and tell Mia stories. She was too dificult to go into.

Stop beating yourself up. Talk to the breeder. They will not be shocked and the relief of getting help is much needed for you and this dog.

Best of luck.

 

[lhsdavis]

I really dont know what to say other than boxers are not for everyone...they can be high energy, and when they are young they can be worse than kids. I was lucky with my female, she turned into a couch potato quite quickly, but boy when its dinner time or after baths she turns into the speed demon. And when she plays with my other Boxer noah she can get rowdy...and there are days she does the kill the bone routine where she throws it up and pounces..I really think its totally funny..Noah my male..the energizer bunny, getting him fixed slowed him down some but not much...and he loves to talk...when he wants the attention he will bark or just do this whiney talk which I love...i was lucky because they never were really chewers of anything other than their own toys and my younger daughter has had the privledge of growing up with these two wonderful examples of boxers...but the thing is they are family and Im not saying give up...but even when they are annoying to the extreme..they make me laugh harder than any other dog Ive met. I guess having two lets them concentrate some of their energy on each other too...but I still think they would have turned out the same. My Noah shares a room with my 14 year old daughter..and while he can be annoying to the extreme with his quacking toys (hes my big toy freak) and wanting to play...what does my 14 year old do? Spends her money to buy him more noisy annoying toys because in the end she really loves him to do his nutty crazy stuff that make her laugh...her phone is full of his pictures, videos of his talking/barking at her because I really believe he thinks he can talk....It did take them a couple years to settle down and when I went over to friends house who of course discovered their love of boxers and now have a 6 month old I got a flashback of the younger years of mine...but they adore him...even when hes nuts..he is one of the smartest dogs they have ever met and he is making them young again..(their kid in college and has a boxer who they fell in love with)...so it really is my philosophy that you either love the breed or you dont...and every time I look at mine they still make me melt because they are there for me....and it does sound like some resentment is building..and he probably senses that and might be reacting because they really do get close to their owners...Ashley my female is really tuned in to me...and Im sure the breeder will understand if its not working if you be honest with her...she wouldnt put it in her contract to bring him back if she didnt know that it doesnt always work out, and she cares enough to ensure she gets him back if thats the case. I got a lab puppy one time...and it only took a few days to know not the dog for me...chewed everything in site...and that same lab ended up in a far better home, even though to this day I still feel guilty about taking him back.....I wish you the best

 

[Kilby'sMum]

I feel exhausted for you.. clearly you've done a lot of work with your boy and give him a lot of physical activity. They are a breed unlike any other (most trainers we've dealt with will attest to that) and can drive you crazy at the best of times!

Our first puppy wouldn't go to sleep unless I physically held her and she ALWAYS wanted to be doing something, never sat still. I can walk/run her for up to 3hrs and she would still keep going if I let her but we say no to her and now she finds something else to do. We buy her lots of toys to destroy and like many have said here, the chewing seems to calm her down enormously. She's still very active and would take any exercise we give her but now at just over 3yrs old she is much calmer. She has always been very quiet though, hardly ever makes noise. Even as a puppy if we put her outside with a big bone from the butcher we would have to drag her away from it even to go for a walk.

Our second pup (just over 7mths) was a NIGHTMARE. We realised our first girl was an angel by comparison. Our baby was/is very dog aggressive (which makes obedience training very difficult) and ignores us 95% of the time. She really was awful and when she was 3-4mths I was where you are now... I was ready to call the breeder and take her back. BUT I decided to put in a final effort and that really revolved around training us... as hard as it was my husband and I made a pact that she would only ever feel love and happiness from us for 2 weeks, no matter what happened we'd ignore the bad stuff and shower her with affection at every other opportunity. When I couldn't handle being happy with her hubby stepped in and vice versa. Well we noticed a big difference within 2-3 days; she wasn't barking at us as much or biting her big sister so much - she was just a lot calmer and started being able to focus on other things. I definitely think they pick up on your attitude and if you really don't like him then I'd say he's picking up on that and if you can't put on a happy face around him and really mean it (which after 2yrs I don't know that I could either) then you're probably making the right decision for all of you by finding him a new home.

I talked to our breeder about how aggressive our new pup was and yes she was taken aback and a bit rude to start out with but I kept on talking until I felt like she had something of the full picture and eventually she stopped being defensive and she came up with a few things for us to try. She really didn't believe a pup could be as aggressive as I was describing so I offered for her to come to our place and see or we could drop the pup off with her (which she politely declined!) When I hung up the phone I still felt like she was a bit crabby but I felt a whole lot better Be prepared for your friend/breeder to take a bit of attitude and be somewhat defensive but you're the one that lives with him so don't be afraid to tell him/her all about it as well as all the things you've tried. Surely having a conversation BEFORE you get rid of your boy is going to be a whole lot easier than explaining why he isn't around later on? If they really love the breed then they'll help you any way they can (be that by offering advice, taking the dog for a week or 2 or helping you find him a new home).

Good luck with your decision, I certainly don't envy you at all.

 

[Murp.mm]

My girl didn't settle until 3 yrs. She wasn't a bad girl but needed lots of exercise and still do at almost 5. She was a real pest when we had company. She would be up in my face and trying to get upon everyone else when she got the chance. She would bring her toys and try to get me to play with her. I actually didn't like to have company over when she was younger. But at around 3 yrs old she settled down and would go off to bed after checking our friends out. But she still needs lots of exercise. The best exercise has been to let her run off lead with another dog whether it's on a hiking trail or in the ball field. I walk her everyday but she still needs that good run off lead every once in awhile and the difference is when she's with another big dog - running alone doesn't tire her as much. For her that's the trick and always has been especially when she was your pups age. As well we have another dog - a little poodle. They are great buddies and that helped her along too. Indeed some boxers are more active and get into things easier. If you work in the day he is surely going to be a ball of energy when you come home. I don't envy you. I'm retired so I could put all my time and energy into our girl. It paid off big time and she is just a joy to have around even though she still can get into mischief when she's bored (like taking my books from my night table and deciding to read them - along with my glasses if I leave them) but that's not too often anymore. She makes us laugh so often now that we can't imagine life without her. They do settle down but I've rarely heard of one before age 3. I remember being a the vet with my girl when she was a pup and this man had this big boxer. He proceeded to tell me that boxers are 3 before they settle down. I was like oh no three more years of this but I think you are almost there. If you can stick it out I'm willing to bet he'll settle down unless he has some other behaviour problems that needs to be looked at. Wishing you all the best in your decision. I know it won't be an easy one. Take care.
'

 

[NJBoxermom]

3 things come to mind...and I may just start a BW riot

My 10 yr old dog sounds exactly like your boy when she was younger. Personally, I love that kind of personality - sure there were days we wanted to pull our hair out, but looking back, they are a source of some funny stories and family bonding. We used to call her "Devil Dog".

Your dog needs a job - I believe he is high energy and *smart* - a very difficult combination. In addition, to the obedience work, you should do something fun and challenging for him like agility. It's a great way to relieve some of the boxer bounce, and it's fun for you too.


You need a place outside for him to be when you need a time out other than his crate. Is your backyard fenced in? If it's not, do you have a run he could be safely contained w/ some toys, water and shelter?

Here's where my unpopular advice is going to incite a riot...a dog like yours needs a canine pal to play with and for companionship. Yes, it's double the work, and expenses, however, there is something that another dog can provide that you never will be able too. Another boxer (yes I said another one) would be ideal, or any other dog that is responsive to his playful nature. If you are not interested in getting another dog, how about going to a local dog park, or making a playdate w/ the boxer breeder's dogs.

I'm really sorry that you aren't enjoying him, and it is possible that this is not the breed for you. My girls are almost 9 and 10, and they spend a good part of their day sleeping, however, when they are awake, they are in the middle of everything we do.

Best Wishes.