kit02 said:
I’ve read the feeding page a few times. I’m confused on some things after reading some posts also – not necessarily this one but the puppy feeding in general. That’s why I was asking questions
b/c personally I get the feeling from some posts (not the feeding guidelines page) that all puppy formulas are bad b/c it promotes rapid growth, but that's not necessarily true for all brands, correct?
Well I think you're being a little bit unfair there - or perhaps because you read that advice often, you get the feeling that people are being told not to touch puppy food with a bargepole. But the question asked by the OP here was
how necessary is it to feed puppy formula, and would it hurt to feed adult food. The answer given, which is absolutely correct is that it is not neccessary at all - and at it's worst it can be harmful. An adult or all-life-stages formula is often a better choice. Since nobody happens to know which food or foods are being asked about, or indeed *if* a specific food is being asked about, it is quite right to point that out and refer the poster to the feeding page. Besides, it answers the actual question asked
No, not
all puppy formulas are bad (overloaded). So you need to read the packaging. But a food (whether adult or puppy) shouldn't really exceed about 22-25% protein. And you need to make a bit of a judgement as to how much of it is likely to be useable protein too, because that isn't disclosed on the label.
The exception to that would be foods formulated for extremely active dogs - like Innova Evo. But you shouldn't feed that to puppies (and even Innova says so - there's too much protein for them). Excess protein fed to an adult isn't such a problem, it'll mostly be flushed as waste. But in puppies it will promote excessive growth...
As far as the California Natural – why does the puppy formula have less calcium? According to the feeding thoughts here, wouldn’t that be a good thing? Or am I missing something?
No idea - you'd have to ask the manufacturer of California Natural. Perhaps the amount of calcium in their food is too high for puppies, or perhaps the actual amount of calcium is the same (or greater) but it just represents a lesser percentage of the food overall.
I’ve also read suggestions here on BW to feed an adult formula just feed more of it. Is that correct advice?
Not exactly. As Debbie has explained above, you would feed a greater amount to a puppy than to an
adult dog of the same weight. So your 8 week old boxer gets more than your adult chihuahua, even though they weigh the same. Your 8 week old boxer pup does NOT get more (or even as much) as your 2 year old boxer.
This is exactly the sort of guideline you get on the packaging of all-life-stages foods like Canidae.
And if so wouldn’t that be pretty much the same thing as feeing less of a puppy food?
Not necessarily - protein isn't everything. LOL - dogs do not live on protein alone, they need other vitamins, minerals, carbohydrates, and fats. If it were the case, we could just take one of the really overloaded foods (the sort up around 44% protein) and just feed a handful
Owen’s nutritionist said that puppies need more of certain nutrients and an adult formula is fine if they eat more, but not all puppies will eat more, that’s where the puppy formula would work out good b/c it’s more nutrient dense. Of course not one’s that have 44% though.
Puppies need more
per pound of body weight, not more in total. Just like human kids.
And no, not all puppies will eat more. But 99% of them will eat what their bodies require irrespective of what any food manufacturer puts on the package (which is only ever a general guideline anyway). Their nutritional needs vary substantially with their growth spurts and we
should allow them to eat less during the periods their bodies need less. It is far better for a puppy to be thin than fat, and it is precisely us trying to force excess nutrition into them when they don't need it that causes excess growth in the first place. We should also remember that their growth rates, and hence their nutritional needs, will slow as they get bigger and be very careful not to overfeed.
I know nothing about raw feeding but another nutritionist I was talking to said raw fed puppies tend to be fed even more protein than kibble puppy formulas sometimes?
Well like anything else it depends on precisely what you feed. Most raw diets would be close to the 22% protein level. It could be higher if you fed a lot of offal and muscle meats though.
I guess the bottom line on any food that you feed to a puppy is that it needs to meet their nutritional needs and support their growth. But if you exceed that, then it can be harmful. And we're talking permanent damage.
Adult formula food though, especially when you're talking premium brands, is already adequate to support puppy growth. And because puppies will self-regulate (ie. eat less when their bodies need less) then adult food is less risky than puppy food precisely because the amount you need to feed to constitute overnutrition is greater...
So where does that leave us? Actually back with the advice given on the feeding page
It is not *necessary* to feed a specific puppy formula food, a high quality adult or all-life-stages formulation is perfectly adequate for a puppy's needs and generally less risky when it comes to overnutrition and the permanent problems that causes. But if you do choose to feed puppy food, be careful to ensure that it does not contain excessive amounts of protein and calcium, and switch to an adult food by 4-6 months.
