Black Boxers - Again!

[Sarah R]

I've read that puppies should leave their mothers no earlier then 7 weeks and preferably 8 for the reasons that Alisha stated, but also so they will learn pecking order from mama. This is suppose to make it easier to except you as the boss later. Whether they are weaned is irrelevant. Some where it seems as though I've read that is is possible to keep them too long with the litter also but I don't remember what that time frame was. Does anyone know?
Amy the breeder you bought your pup from shouldn't release them so soon. Her ad stated them ready 3-8-01 and even that was too early ; she let you have yours even sooner.:( Even if you didn't know better, she should. This women obviously doesn't show her dogs and isn't doing a thing to better the breed, she's also in a big hurry to get rid of her puppies so she can't even say that she is breeding for the joy of it and because she loves puppies. Her intentions can't even be construed as misguided; her intentions are blatantly obvious and shame on her.

 

[Lisa M]

Re: Who is arguing ???

Originally posted by Sidney's Mama
I am only saying what the breeder told me ! This is a chat board, not a fight board !

Yes, but the breeder was either lieing or ill-informed, so those of us who know that there are no black boxers were just trying to let you know the real deal. I could sell "pink" boxers but just because I call them pink doesn't make it so. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad you are happy with your pup, but it seems to me that the breeder was irresponsible, not only in letting the pup go at such a young age but also with regards to labeling to coat incorrectly, and I saw the pictures you posted of the parents, they did not seem to be very good breeding stock in my opinion which should be the most important consideration when anyone considers breeding.

It is great that you are in love with your boxer puppy, it should be no other way. There is nothing wrong with having imperfect pets, both of mine are from the shelter, Casper's white with droppy eyes and Sumi is a mixed breed, they are the best dogs I've ever had and the fact that they wouldn't be good breeding stock to an ethical breeder does not affect my love for them in any way - nothing anyone could say or do would make me want to part with them or stop loving them.

One of the things I really like about this board is its commitment to ethical breeding and education about the boxer. I'm glad that you love your boxer but I stand by my original statement that there are no black boxers and it doesn't really matter that the breeder called the black, to me it is just evidence that she doesn't really know what she's doing.

I once got a dog that a homeless guy was selling before they were even weened, I had to bottle feed her - she was only 3 weeks old. Yes, the pup was fine, but I paid him $5 dollars for her and I knew that the pups would most likely all die so I decided I could at least try to "save" one. She did great, but was never really good around other dogs, she liked people and was rather stubborn, if I had gotten her from a breeder though I would expect them to have known and insisted that the pups stay with the mom for the correct amount of time. I tried to explain that to the man, but it didn't matter to him, he wanted money and he wanted it sooner rather than later.

And to Linda, as a boxer owner and lover, frankly, I care that the dog is called by its correct name, an owner should know what they have and be honest about it. I'm not trying to fight but to provide accurate information. I can just imagine this woman's profits if the "rare" black boxer tale gets out. It is a shame that the "breeder" didn't attempt to do it.

 

[Sarah R]

To Julie and Matthew:
How did we end up with the reverse brindle effect anyway? Was it just a case of it happening and the breeder liking the results so they kept breeding for it? It is in the American standard but is it not allowed in the European or Australian ring? It must appear sometimes in a litter by accident or no? My pup is a regular fawn brindle, as were all of his litter mates I believe, out of a reverse brindle dam and a brindle sire. If two reverse brindles are bred do you get all reverse puppies?

 

[JulieM]

Sidney's Mama, I'm not trying to fight, just pointing out that perpetuating the myth of "rare" black Boxers increases the demand for them, thereby encouraging unethical breeding practices which release unhealthy dogs on an unsuspecting public. As others have said, Education is paramount.

Sarah, "reverse" brindling (see my reply to Matthew in the picture message - this truly is a misnomer) is really just brindling with a *lot* of stripes! Like white markings, a brindle coat is affected by modifiers which control the amount of brindling. So, breeding reverse brindle to reverse brindle could result in puppies that are reverse brindle, brindle, light brindle, and fawn.

Heavy brindling is mentioned in the US standard - again see my reply to Matthew for more on that. I don't *think* it's "not allowed" in the other standards, but it is frowned upon by many breeders....some in the US as well. Personally, I can't fathom why, but that's an argument that I've already had

 

[beandawgs]

buying a puppy

I'm sure you love your puppy very much but to love the breed is different. You bought your puppy from a backyard breeder who not only bred dogs which don't measure up to breed standard (the father is a very poor looking boxer) but let a puppy go at 6 weeks (in some states that's illegal). It doesn't matter what kind of food he's eating he's not old enough to be away from his litter.

 

[Sidney's Mama]

I think the FATHER is BEAUTIFUL......

I got Sidney when she was 6 weeks old, they seem to bond with you better. I could have had him stay there until he was 8 weeks it was the buyers option, but I choose to bring him home now. In the state of PA it is not againist the law to take pups away from their mother at 6 weeks, so until it is everyone will continue to do it. :p

 

[beandawgs]

:-(

How very sad......no respectable breeder sends their puppies home at 6 weeks.....all the show breeders I know wait until 8 weeks. It has nothing to do with weaning and everything to do with socialization. I hope that anybody reading this thread understands how important it is to wait that time.

 

[Lisa M]

I have to disagree again, they don't "bond" better with you at six weeks. I got Sumi when she was 9 weeks old, I raised one puppy from when she was just three weeks old, and we adopted Casper when he was about a year old. They all love me to death - I've noticed no difference in how close any of them are to me, they bond with the people who feed them, care for them and love them. It is much better for the puppy to learn socialization and doggie manners from its mamma until eight weeks if given the choice.

 

[JulieM]

I agree with Lisa, and many people feel 10 or 12 weeks is an even better age.

And not "everyone" in PA will send puppies home at 6 weeks - there are several reputable breeders in PA who would never dream of doing such a thing. Think about it - it is a law in some states that puppies cannot leave their litter until 8 weeks of age. There must be a *reason* for those laws - and since they are one of the few that *don't* benefit puppy mills, it must be one that benefits the dog.